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Welcome as a guest in the Astrodienst forum. You can login to your Astro profile or register as a forum member.You can also remain in the guest status and navigate through this forum as a reader. 21.12.2014 at 19:20 [UT]
 
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New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel (Read 432 times)
Alois
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New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« on: 11.04.2012 at 16:15 [UT+1] »
 
A new important chart has been discovered (by data collector Grazia Bordoni), that of Golda Meir, former prime minister of Israel.
http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Meir,_Golda

 
She was the third woman ever to hold the post of Prime Minister in any country.
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« Last Edit: 12.04.2012 at 19:22 [UT+1] by Alois »  
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Isaac Starkman
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #1 - on: 12.04.2012 at 15:05 [UT+1] »
 
Wow! What a surprise! It is like to find a treasure… Thank you Grazia!  
It is going to be a sensation not only among the Israeli astrologers, but for many others, as this is the first time, as far as I remember, that a birth time was obtained directly from a register office in Russia (or Ukraine, for that matter).  
Is this means that the birth time was actually recorded in Soviet Union even in the 19th century? I hope someone could supply us more info, when and where the birth time was recorded. There are so many famous Russian- born peoples…
 
[Alois: I am not sure Grazia reads this forum. I have sent her a copy of this posting by email]
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Grazia Bordoni
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #2 - on: 13.04.2012 at 19:38 [UT+1] »
 
It was a big surprise for me too!
I asked my friend if the ukraine girl has friends or relatives in
Rostov on Don, where Sabine Spielrein was born. I'll let you know if
something happens.  Smiley
GraZia
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Alois
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #3 - on: 13.04.2012 at 20:17 [UT+1] »
 
reply regarding Spielrein has been moved to This Thread
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Grazia Bordoni
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #4 - on: 26.04.2012 at 07:34 [UT+1] »
 
I'm really disapponted, but it seems I sent wrong data about Golda Meir.  SadWhat happened? The ukraine girl's brother went to Register Office in Kiev and asked sveral birthtimes (to get several horoscopes!). Informing his sister he mixed up birthtimes (I could kill him for this), so now he rectified and says Golda Meir was born two minutes before midnight. The correct data could be:
Kiev, 2nd May 1898, 23.58 (11.58 p.m.).
Well, I have a very suspicious mind, so don't know how much reliable are this data. Caution!
 
GraZia
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Alois
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #5 - on: 26.04.2012 at 08:31 [UT+1] »
 
Thank you for the update, Grazia. The 23:58 looks suspicious to me. I have not seen any registry data from this period, in any country, where time was given that precise.
 
Local mean time of Kiev is 2h02 minutes ahead of GMT. This could be an attempt to give GMT.
For 3 May 1898, 02:00 am local time, GMT is 23:58 on 2 May.
 
Please inquire again, whether your source converted local time to GMT on his own.
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Grazia Bordoni
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #6 - on: 26.04.2012 at 12:41 [UT+1] »
 
Uhm, Alois, I fear this is a too sophisticated information for the ukraine girl... I'll forward your good observation to my friend, she'll try to investigate.
 
GraZia
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Isaac Starkman
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #7 - on: 27.04.2012 at 07:24 [UT+1] »
 
I asked the astrologer from Moscow, who supplied me the info on the birth time recording in Russia:
forum.astro.com/cgi/forum.cgi?num=1332152330
 
 if it possible that a birth time was officially recorded in Kiev at the end of 19th century. She replied me that in Russia an official document with birth time started only in 2006, and birth times from 1960 are keeping ONLY in hospitals. Birth time from 1898? By no means!  
I asked her to investigate it again. Untill I will get a confirmation, I see the birth time for Golda only as a bluff.
It will be interested to know for which years that fellow claimed to get other birth times from the register office in Kiev.  
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Isaac Starkman
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #8 - on: 19.07.2012 at 14:47 [UT+1] »
 
Maria Chistyakova, an astrologer from Moscow wrote me:
1 There is no Register Office with birth time of Persons who was born more than 100 years ago. (Russia is not England)
2. The family of Golda was VERY poor. Who was interested in registration of their birth time? It's unreal.
3. The history of Kiev is terrible.  It was destroyed (60%) when German Army came.
4.   In 1941-1943 over 70,000  Jews were murdered in Baby Yar and other places near Kiev. I read that all relatives of Golda’s family died. (Having regards that the family leaved Kiev in 1903!) Who and when can speak with Golda’s mother???  And it's very doubtful that Mother can remember the bell in her condition and that the bell can ring in midnight.
5.  In 1948 before Golda was appointed to the position of ambassador in USSR, there was the request to the Kiev Synagogue registration books about any information of Golda.  
 The answer was that there is no information about Golda in the period of 1897-1899.
http://www.alexanderyakovlev.org/fond/issues-doc/6906
 
In view of Maria's arguments, I think that the RR should be downgraded to DD!
 
 
 
 
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Alois
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Re: New data: Golda Meir, prime minister of Israel
« Reply #9 - on: 19.07.2012 at 20:45 [UT+1] »
 
Quote from Isaac Starkman on 19.07.2012 at 14:47 [UT+1]:

In view of Maria's arguments, I think that the RR should be downgraded to DD!

I have done so, putting your message into the source notes. Thank you.
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