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Astro-Databank: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari (Read 107 times)
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Astro-Databank: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« on: 07.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
Discussion about
Bilawal Bhutto Zardari, born 21 September 1988 at 09:30 AM in Karachi
 
This discussion is imported from the  comment board on the  previous astrodatabank.com website.

We have several birth times on file for Benazir Bhutto, the Pakistani political leader, who was assassinated this past month. None of the times have yet been verified though one of the times is said to have come from her father's astrologer. Bhutto was a powerful and riveting figure. Because her data currently carries a Rodden Rating of DD, we prefer not to feature her chart for discussion. However, owners of AstroDatabank versions 3 and 4 will be able to download the revised record and complete source notes. For purposes of this week's newsmaker, we thought it would instead be instructive to look at the chart of her young son and possible successor, Bilawal Bhutto Zardari. Let's use some caution when analyzing his chart, remembering that he is young yet and that astrological symbolism plays out in various ways.
  • <p class="MsoNormal"> Although he not yet 20 years old, he has been thrust into the public eye by the tragic death of his mother.  Where in Bilawal's chart might you see the power of his maternal lineage and the tragic violence of it? What factors might describe his father's absence through imprisonment?  If Bilawal were your client, how would you describe these family influences and what would you tell him that might be helpful to him?
  • <p class="MsoNormal"> Let's look at some of his personal qualities. He's been described as shy and studious yet popular, charismatic and fun-loving, an athlete and sports fan.  Where are these traits and preferences seen in his chart? He has shown some ambivalence toward party leadership and political involvement. Is the ambivalence shown in his chart or is he just not ready to assume responsibility yet? What do you make of his exact Ascendant-Pluto conjunction in Scorpio, with Mars retrograde in Aries? He is said to have inherited his mother's eloquence. What in the chart might indicate that he has the speaking skills necessary to inspire the crowds as his mother did?  Does the chart argue for a public or private role in life?
  • <p class="MsoNormal"> What factors in his chart might indicate that he would spend so many of his formative years outside his native country and its traditions?
  • <p class="MsoNormal"> Like others born around his birth date, Bilawal has a natal Saturn-Uranus conjunction. How does the natal Saturn-Uranus conjunction play out in Bilawal's life? Although aspects of the slower moving planets coincide with global events, we feel them personally as well, based on our age, our chart, and other factors.  Note that his natal conjunction recently received the impact of the transiting Jupiter-Pluto conjunction. How would you have interpreted this powerful transit if Bilawal had consulted you a year ago? You will note also that transiting Saturn and Uranus are forming the first of five exact oppositions that occur from late 2008 to mid-2010.  What counsel would you extend to Bilawal about these oppositions?
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #1 - on: 10.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User M
 
This is a chart of great destiny
We should note that Mars and Pluto which co-rule the chart are both in their positions of rulership, Mars in Aries and Pluto in Scorpio, rising...The exalted character of both planets shows us what we know...born to rule from a ruling dynasty..esp as the ruling planet, Pluto rises in its own sign...of course with great privilege comes great responsibility and perhaps disaster...a Yod exists to Pluto, the ruling planet..which means he will spend the entire life inheriting the burden of the family...his person and personality will be the forefront of his life..he can go of course in two directions...partnerships and the service of others (7th house) or pleasure and duty (5th/6th house cusp)..but he will never leave the spotlight and what cost his mother her life, may well cost him his..the Yod can bring disaster..
Venus is exalted at the top of the chart conjoined to the midheaven in the royal and show sign of Leo, he will prove attractive and is already being touted as "hot" by the media...a good position for political players..in square with Pluto though he may use his looks to his advantage proving to be a womanizer and a corrupt person...his stints in jail like his father may prove to be well founded..the square so prominent shows one attracted to gambling and strong indulgent passions and as it coincides with the ruling planet and the apex of the Yod it may well prove disasterous...he will be lustful as well
He inherited the weak Jupiter from his mother, hers may well be unaspected, depending on her time of birth and as part of his Yod, he is clearly her dynastic successor, the family curse which has killer his mother, grandfather and two uncles runs in the chart, he should always be well protected and weary of violence...Pluto rising in a violent sign such as Scorpio does not paint a picture very different than politics in Pakistan...he should always remain well guarded and try to avoid controversy
Jupiter in the 7th house to me, co-ruling the 5th house, suggests a young marriage...Venus ruling the 7th house so prominent in Leo suggests a partner of great prominence, perhaps royal or other dynastic connections..Venus occupying the nodal degree, shows some sort of fated connection with this spouse, perhaps tragic in her own right...ruling the 12th house as well there is alot of karma in this chart, esp in conjunction with the natal Yod...this soul was once prominent before...he has much Karma to fulfill...
The Sun-Moon trine in earth tells us what we know...money will never be an issue...but because the moon is in Capricorn..there is always a chance of a political fall, esp as it rules the 9th house of politics and religion..without mutual reception of any kind...the vertex in the 9th house tells us he was born to be political...the chart as a whole fits well together...
This is a very fated and fascinating chart...there is a great deal of karma here and he clearly inherited his mothers families benefits and burdens...to survive he must be very cautious because this a most dangerous chart..old age is not automatically bestowed here
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #2 - on: 11.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Marjorie
 
It's a complex chart this one, less obviously that of a courageous politician and powerful orator than his mother's. That central out-of-sign T square of Sun opposition Mars square Saturn, Uranus, Neptune is quite difficult to quantify (I know, I know Wayne but 9 degrees is acceptable in a T square). The exact Mars Neptune square would point to Neptune as the strongest focal point which makes him a dreamer, impatient to see his dreams realized but lacking staying power and commitment. That is backed up by the Pisces Node in the 5th which also tends to live in fantasyland and lacks discipline in early adult life. Plus his secondary progressed Mars, Mercury and Jupiter are all retrograde for some years to come. His mother oddly is less strongly suggested as an influence (Moon Mercury and Venus in 10th are fairly light) than his father Zardari whom he won't have seen much of in his childhood since he was in prison. Father expects too much (Saturn), is erratic (Uranus) and none too straightforward (Neptune). The heavy family inheritance as such I would imagine comes down the male line from his executed maternal grandfather Zulfikar Ali Bhutto - Jupiter in 8th sextile Mars. Bilawal's Sun is opposition his grandfather's Jupiter Uranus conjunction in Pisces (5 Jan 1928, Larkana, Pakistan) so there's a resonance there. His chart does sit fairly exactly on the Pakistan chart I use (9.30 am 14th Aug 1947) with his Sun on the exact degree of the Ascendant and Saturn Uranus conjunct the I.C. So he is important in what's to come though he won't have his troubles to seek come 2012 with the Uranus Pluto square hitting his Mars Neptune square exactly. Before then there may be a tug of war with his father or he'll be suppressed (sidelined) by him. The Mars (29 Pisces) opposition Pluto (4 Libra) on their composite hinting at a dominating relationship is being furthered strained by transitting Pluto till 2011, plus Saturn in 2010, and Uranus thereafter. Poor kid.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #3 - on: 11.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Judith kent
 
I am sure you must have the wrong year???
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #4 - on: 11.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Min Wilson
 
The combination of Pluto and Chiron has been called "the deepest wound." The IC is an indicator of the mother. When this young man's mother was killed, transiting Pluto had just passed over both IC rulers, Saturn and Uranus; and Chiron was on the IC. Also, transiting Chiron had recently squared the natal Pluto. The transits "past due" suggest that this loss took some time to develop and culminated with the actual Chiron transit to the IC -- and at the same time transiting Pluto square the Sun, which is the MC ruler.  
It would appear that Bilawal's career path will be deeply influenced by his mother (MC ruler square IC rulers) and by her death. And with Venus, the DC ruler, on his MC, the people may call upon him for leadership, seeing him as the son of the martyr: at the time of the assassination, transiting Chiron was approaching opposition to natal Venus, and transiting Pluto was in exact minor square to N Venus.
Finally, the natal Sun square Saturn and Uranus locks in, by minor squares, with the Pluto AC square Venus MC. With AC ruler Pluto on the AC, maybe he will have the strength to handle this stressful and dangerous-looking combination. And with natal Chiron trine natal Pluto AC, he may have the capacity to benefit from the deepest wounds, and from adversity in general.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #5 - on: 11.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
m quote>>i tend to talk in terms of politics gut wise first and check the charts later...<<
i believe that is where your comment - 'this is a chart of great destiny' came from as well...
where does one see great destiny in a chart?? this kid is the son of a well known world political figure who was assassinated very recently... he has assumed the leadership of his moms political party (with his dad), due her assassination. it makes a good one liner opening, but it's not something connected to the chart so much as an awareness of current events as i see it..
this chart is about power, inheritance and the potential to recognize ones spiritual nature.. pluto in scorpio on the ascendant is an ongoing test on a few fronts giving him a choice between the use or abuse of power, position and inheritance... maybe someone else would be better to lead his moms party. however he would have difficulty relinquishing his inherited role..  
50/50 chance he suffers the same fate as his mom. is it a family curse, someting like british royalty, but of a different kind? both have mars in an oppositional position in their charts, hers thru the sun/mars conj near desc and his thru sun/mars opp.. he has a black belt in taekwondo which fits with the mars in aries, pluto on the ascendant.. he will definitely meet with opposition. her chart has pluto in the 8th while he has jupiter in the 8th, which is much more favourable with regard to ones inheritances.. he benefits from friendships that can help him steer this political inheritance in a way that is not a liability, but a reward.. oxford the place he is presently studying history is a place of great history in itself where one does make important connections internationally..
sun square the saturn/uranus suggests radical changes in ones life's direction from time to time, this last month being the latest in what will likely be a series of radical changes that happen approx every 7 or so years with the saturn transit.. moon in capricorn is not a warm position concerned with the needs or welfare of others so much as the continued ambitioms of ones own self.. at least with his mom, the 10th house moon was close to the self sacrificing combo saturn/neptune, something that is not seen anywhere in this chart... both have the moon/mercury square, indicating a nervous jittery mental temperament.. always on the go, likely quite well read and always on the lookout for friendships that can serve ones personal ambitions is how i read this combo..
his moon/mercury square is on the angles for his home in dubai. jupiter is conj oxford uk midheaven (8 gemini)where he is presently studying history. he has said he plans on completing his education before returning to lead the party full time...
venus conj midheaven in leo would appear to be a regal position commanding loyalty.. it might be more suited to success in some artist pursuit instead of leading a political group until one sees the square to pluto which clouds and describes it better.. >> Installing the teenager as the PPP's standard-bearer was an astute move in a society where loyalty to personalities and ruling families trumps loyalty to organizations and institutions.<< forming relationships designed to take advantage of others politically is something he is going to have to learn how to overcome.. once again the opportunity for self realization is knocking on the door here through the potentially fatalistic relationships the venus/pluto suggest. taking the high road is never easy, but it is made very concrete with squares to a prominent pluto with periodic transits from saturn.. he is still very young, so everything appears upbeat and rosy as long as one doesn't examine too closely just what exactly he has inherited.. the girls love him.. great!
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #6 - on: 11.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User M
 
S,
I will respond to that by saying you are incorrect. I know very little of this person, only what I have heard in recent days and it is well possible that a young man who lost his mother and uncles and grandfather over politics would decline this, shun the role and try to have a normal life. This is not in the cards and not by my hunch, but by his chart. A Yod so prominent in a chart is not only a mere Yod but it is as if fate is forcing the issue. I have seen many Yods and some are more prominent than others, but this Yod and this chart are forecasters of destiny. The chart is no the product of him, he is the product of this chart. I have no vested interest in this chart being a bringer of fate, many children of great people themselves become nothings or even worthless. Such a fate is not allowed to this boy.  
This chart will come to pass, more so than perhaps even mine and yours, we are all chess pieces of providence but some are more prominent than others and some have less choice than others, this boy is one of those pieces. The chart as a whole from Venus at the nodal degree at the midheaven...from both chart rulers in exalt and the chart ruler at the ascendant, from the weak Jupiter inherited from the mother...it is all woven together to form a path for him to follow...He has no choice in the matter, he could have like so many others a very ordinary chart, but here we do not see that, because a parent is prominent means nothing..it was his fate to watch his mother die, his fate to inherit her position and quite possibly as i suspect his fate to go the same way she did. He could have easily said no, but fate will not let him, perhaps he fears if he doesnt do it he will let his mother die in vain, perhaps he doesnt want to disapoint his other family members, perhaps he seeks fame in his own right...regardless, the yod and chart have forced him into a prominent position and to be honest, he never had much of a choice.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #7 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
plenty of others have a chart close to, or the same as this fellow.. if we didn't know who the chart belonged to, i doubt we would be looking at it the same way... yods, may speak of fate, but pluto speaks of the same and more.. pluto being the planet most significant in this chart addresses the issue of fate directly.. how much can he overcome, and how much is beyond his ability to deal with effectively?? i like to think in terms of freewill more then fate, but since we are talking about it, i think it is an open question how much of one is present more then the other...  
i see a few yods in the chart.. which one are you referring to? the one with jupiter at top i presume, but pluto is at the top of one also... both point to a different struggle. the relationship with the 2 planets at the top of these yods - pluto and jupiter- is where his process of self discovery and dilemma of adjustment (to his inheritance) are centered on.  
i also meant to comment on the mars/neptune square a combo sometimes found in the charts of addicts, which is very pronounced in this chart.. it forms a part to both yods and is presently being transited ( midpoint ) by neptune, which coincides with his moms death and casts a confusing pale over his direction from here... it weakens his resolve and ability to act in his own best interests as i see it... it is a potentially undermining influence. i think he has his work cut out for him with a chart like this.
 saying you see it as a chart of great destiny is reading current affairs into the chart.. i think that is fine, as without knowing who the chart belongs to, it could as easily belong to any number of things, buildings, etc. etc. as it happens it belongs to someone who is undoubtedly going to play some sort of role in politics as a consequence of what he has inherited.. back to pluto, planet connected to inheritance and in his particular chart - jupiter located in the 8th..
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #8 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
mars/neptune midpoint is 22 aq 20 jupiter/pluto midpoint 23 leo 28..
all tied together via midpoint and with transit of neptune close by.. the station retro of neptune on may 25th of last year was at 22 aq 02.  
both he and his mothers moon/mercury squares connect with one another 1 degree orb... his mercury conj her moon and her mercury opp his moon.. these mercury/moons were transited by the first quarter moon at same spot on oct 18th when she returned to pakistan... the midpoint to these mercury/moon combos is 8 mutable where the saturn station sat throughout the month of december and early jan...
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #9 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User cynthia
 
this is total heresay
yesterday, my husband spoke with a young Pakistani man. This graduate student happened to be in the city when this native's mother was killed. Apparantly the whole city was locked down for 3 days.
The Pakistani graduate student said that he believes it was B. Bhutto's estranged husband who had her killed so he might gain power over the party through their son.
So, much of what M and Marjorie have said here may be "dead" on. In fact, B. Bhutto may have a hand in keeping her estranged husband jailed, but again this is only heresay from someone who grew up there and happened to be home when she was killed.  
He also said that it was not a big threat to have a woman in political power, and in fact, quite common. He said that Musharref had nothing to fear from her nor to gain from her, so in his mind had nothing to do with her killing.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #10 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
sun = venus/pluto midpoint as well.. the venus/pluto square is most significant due its connection to the angles, but sun at its midpoint is more emphasis..
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #11 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User cynthia
 
yipes...I meanr to say hearsay...not heresay
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #12 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Carol
 
M wrote: "This chart will come to pass, more so than perhaps even mine and yours, we are all chess pieces of providence but some are more prominent than others and some have less choice than others, this boy is one of those pieces."
M, with all due respect you seem to be ignoring the first cardinal rule regarding how fate vs. free will is indicated in a chart, i.e., Western emphasis is fate, and Eastern is free will, and this guy's chart has 8 out of 10 planets on the East side. It screams to high heaven of FREE WILL! At least from that most important standpoint.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #13 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Marjorie
 
Hmm. I tend to take such conspiracy theories perhaps too lightly since they don't sit comfortably with me and sometimes I'm wrong. But what I do know is the Pakistanis and Indians are highly excitable and live in a world of such corrupt politics, they tend to see sinister motives behind everything. I'd think it more likely that Musharraf's Secret Intelligence who aren't totally under his control, who are right wing and fairly in with the Taleban, thus very anti-American, were probably behind Benazir Bhutto's murder, since she was the US-picked solution to the Pakistan problem. Plus it's almost as if she had a death wish. A touch like Indira Gandhi who knew she was in danger from her security people and took no action. If Benazir's birth time of 7.59 pm is correct it put her Secondary Progressed Sun conjunct her 8th house Pluto with transitting Neptune approaching the opposition to Pluto. So there was a tremendous pull there. Martyrdom for a greater cause. Maybe the inevitability of it in her mind or her identification with her father made her almost volunteer for it. Zardari, the husband, is all set I would imagine to make himself richer with Pluto heading for a trine to his Jupiter in 2009/10. Bilawal has his Secondary Progressed Moon approaching a conjunction with his Secondary Progressed Sun at the moment so clearly something was coming together for him at an inner level early this year. Also if his birth time is right his Sun is conjunct his Asc/MC midpoint which will make his life more focussed than some. But I still reckon Bilawal is not practical or determined enough to make a real impact. It's a mutable Saturn and Uranus on the point of that T square which will make him scattered, very highly strung - and Saturn anyway doesn't usually manifest positively until later life - if he manages to survive that long. Pluto driving the Yod will make him introspective. Plus his retrograde Mercury doesn't go direct until he's 30; his retro Mars when he's 37 and retro Jupiter never.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #14 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User M
 
S,
The Pluto Yod is the most prominent one and the one i refer to, i will get to ur points when i have more time
Cynthia,
Thank you. On that region, anything goes. It rivals the middle east in treachery and unsavory characters, this boys father was actually nicknamed "10 percent" when he was foreign minister he was so used to taking bribes that that was his usual commission...i do not know if he had a hand in his wifes death...but hes far from squeaky clean..there is definitely a element of King Lear and Hamlet going on here.
Carol,
Eastern vs. Western is largely true, but i do tend to ignore than when it comes to Yods, as a finger of G-d there is an element of fate regardless...it may end in the 1st house but its still fated
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #15 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
Asif Ali Zardari born 21 July 1956.. anyone have more info on his birthdate?
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #16 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User s
 
it appears he has been born 1953, 1954, 1957 and 1956, so the year is open to speculation as well...
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #17 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Marjorie
 
Sorry I forget what I've put on which website. In fact anything is possible. Bilawal's cousin Fatima and her family do think that Benazir had a hand in ordering the murder of Benazir's brother (Fatima's father) way back when. He had accused Benazir and Zardari of corruption. And a previous brother was poisoned in France just after Zulfikar Ali Bhutto was executed, presumably by the then Pakistan regime. It's worse than a Greek tragedy the whole thing.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #18 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Kathleen Imber
 
God, poor kid. I just keep looking at that rising Pluto in Scorpio in his first house. And it's the only planet in the first, and it's smack-dab right ON his Ascendant!! Sheesh! Well, if nothing else, it gives him enormous staying power and grit, not to mention an uncanny ability to deal with power, violence and death, in their most extreme and hideous forms, as many of the Pluto in Scorpio generation are dealing with. We cannot underestimate the power of Pluto here....especially since it is in its own sign. We are definitly seeing this generation deal with the "extremes." His 4th house(home, mother, family) is ruled by Uranus, and Uranus is in Sagittarius,in his second house(money, values)and is squaring his natal Sun in Virgo.Uranus is also conjunct Saturn in Sag, and Saturn is also squaring his natal Sun in Virgo in the 11th house(political organizations.) Oh, and that Pluto in Scorpio is also being squared by Venus in Leo in his 10th.(Authority figures, fame,the father) So, we see the conflict(squares) with his mothers's side of the family and his father's side, too,(Sun rules the 10th, Sun rules father, along with Saturn). And it all has to do with power(Pluto), money(second house emphasis),and political organizations(11th house emphasis.)And Mars has been retrograding in Gemini in his 8th house of death, and it made a mutable t-square to his natal Saturn, Uranus, and Sun at the time of the assasination of his mother.His natal Moon(emotions) in Capricorn in the 3rd(the mind) gives him good control over his emotions and feelings, it may seem to others that he is reserved and cold or unemotional. But his Moon and Sun are in the common-sense earth signs, and sextile each other, so he is not knocked emotionally or mentally off-balance, as say, a water sign (like Pisces) might be.
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re: Bilawal Bhutto Zardari
« Reply #19 - on: 12.01.2008 at 12:30 [UT] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Marc  
 
Scorpio Rising/Moon in Capricorn is ghastly ghastly ghastly. (It's literally the anti-Christ combo).
And Sun in Virgo just enforces that.  
Ughhhhh.
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