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Astro-Databank: Nation: USA No.1 (Read 469 times)
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Astro-Databank: Nation: USA No.1
« on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
Discussion about
Nation: USA No.1, born 4 July 1776 at 5:10 PM in Philadelphia PA
 
This discussion is imported from the  comment board on the  previous astrodatabank.com website.

Help us decide which is the best chart of the United States. To get a vote you must justify your opinion by referencing at least five of the rectifying dates. We will be tallying each of the votes in a bar chart so we can watch the consensus develop. If you would like to change your vote after reading what others have said we can accommodate that too.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #1 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Lisa La Belle
 
Sorry folks, but I'm a fan of the astrologer Evangeline Adams Gemini Rising chart for the US. The data: 7/4/1776--Philadelphia, PA--2:13:32am (LMT converted to EST). In spite of the lack of evidence supporting an early morning signing of the Declaration of Independence, this chart still remains the most accurate, in my opinion.  
The Gemini Rising of 07 degs. 03 mins. grants the US an amazing gift of "gab" and communication. Many of our US Presidents have been gifted public speakers. It's also no real surprise that we're the leading PC and software manufacturers in the world today.
The conjunction of Uranus at 08 degs. 53 mins. of Gemini to the Ascendant gives the US a certain degree of instability to be sure but, nonetheless it signals an inherent need for freedom and independence which will not be denied. Mars' location also in Gemini in the 1st House at 20 degs. 57 mins., also serves to emphasize this point.
The Sun in Cancer, in the 2nd House, located at 12 degs. 44 mins. says that this country will do its darnedest to hold onto money, and that family values is an issue of importance and/or pride for our Nation.  
The Sun's conjunction to Jupiter also located in the 2nd reiterates this sense of "pride" in the sense that we take care of our own as well as the world.
The Moon's location in Aquarius at 18 degs. 10 mins., in the 10th House clearly states that we're unafraid to display our humanitarianism to the world...flaws and all. It's our "heart and soul" that definitely endears us to the world but...also, we can be looked upon as emotional "cold fishes" because of our ability to be objective in the face of emotional chaos.
Anyway, this is my vote! I hope that everyone enjoys my reasonings. Smiley
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #2 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Ian Thurnwald
 
Dear Astro Databank,  
Why do you want to decide which is the best chart of the USA? Surely this flys in the face of the accepted conventions of mundane astrology, one of which is that we must be wary of using any one chart to represent a country.
In mundane astrolgy it is important to consider all the known charts for the historical processes which relate to nations. Because we are dealing with historical time, not human time, single events in a the process (like the Declaration of Independence) can never tell the whole story. And, while it is preferable to have accurate times for these charts, this is not essential, becasue, as always it's the planetary aspects which are primary. In following a multi-chart approach, what one is looking for is repeating themes in unfolding historical prossesses.
The surprising thing which emerges from this appraoch is that astrology invariably highlights the cosmically significant events in historical processes, and these are not always the events that we humans see as significant. Quite often, the chart for the day when an entity (a nation, a law, a new regime, a president) is legally recognised, either in terms of its own legislature or that of another larger world power, or by some treaty, seems to be the astrologically or cosmically significant one, even though the nation's citizens may not see the event as terribly important.  
Having isolated such an exemplary chart, or charts, the mundane astrologer is in a much better position to consider the true nature and future trends of that entity in relation to wars, invasions, coups, etc. However, even from this better informed position it is a mistake (all too easily made) to use just the one or two charts as representative of the entity itself. Instead it is best to relate the astrology of the current event under consideration, back to all the charts of the nation, to see what areas (legislature, finances, national pride, etc) are strongly affected.  
For example, the Silby chart is the commonly recognised birth chart of the nation, even though the Declaration of Independence was a statement of revolutionary ideological intent, not the legal beginning of the USA. From my outsider's point of view this chart cannot be seen as representative of the nation itself, rather it is a statement of what America stands for, and I would argue that it is more representative of the psyche of the nation. So when this chart is strongly stimulated by progressions and transits (as it is now, and has been for a while now) it is the national psyche which is affected.  
In terms of the logic of this argument, other charts have to be referred to if we want to get a full picture of the impact of an event on the nation. If the legal birth chart of the constitution, the Articles of Confederation (Solte chart), is strongly stimulated, then the basic tenets of the constitution are affected. If it's the Stars & Stripes chart, then nationalism and its symbolic representations are affected.  
In short, I'd argue that the astrologer has to use all relevant charts for a nation and pitch the interpretation in accordance with what each chart is about, what each one stands for. IMHO this is a far better appraoch than trying to make any one chart (like July 4th, 1776) fit all events. For one thing, it eliminates the need to bother with time consuming, moment focused, rectifications and keeps the mundane astrologer's attention focused on the big picture where it belongs.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #3 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User marianne thompson
 
i know nothing of mundane astrology and would be loathe to make any assumptions on the veracity of a particular chart but one thing that i do know... the timing of the event which took place on 9-11-2001 at 8:45 am, give or take a minute or so dependant upon whose time you accept as valid, is incontrovertible.
the psyche of the people of the united states was ripped asunder, we were reeling in shock, walking around in utter disbelief for at least two weeks after the attack, unable to process or accept what we had witnessed.  
dobyns chart is the only one that reflects a direct, shocking, abrupt hit to the moon.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #4 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Anthony Louis
 
In her book "Astrology for Everyone", the noted American astrologer Evangeline Adams used a Gemini rising chart set for 3:03 in the morning. She was such an influential astrologer in the early 1900s in the USA that I think you should include her chart in your list or at least in our comments on the 3:10 chart.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #5 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert P Blaschke
 
Seven astrologers were at a bus stop late one night, going home after a lecture. Even though the speaker had been discussing composite charts, the subject eventually drifted around to the various USA charts.
One astrologer with Virgo rising got into a hair-splitting argument with another astrologer who had Mercury opposite Pluto. They were going at it about the fractional difference in the Sibly chart's Ascendant when one uses geographic, in lieu of geocentric latitude for Philadelphia, thereby resulting in a difference of 7 minutes of arc (12 Sagittarius 28 vs 12 Sagittarius 21) for the Ascendant.
Another astrologer, having used 268 asteroids, some the size of a large grapefruit, to rectify the angles according to important dates in US history, got into it with an astrologer with Saturn conjunct the Ascendant who only used the Lights and the five classical planets in his work.
Still another astrologer, who was a Civil War buff, vociferously argued that the Sibly chart had to be the correct one, because on April 12, 1861, when the first shots rang out from Fort Sumter, that chart had a progressed Full Moon within 21 minutes of arc, in a tight T-Square to the USA Jupiter, and that the progressed Mercury was tightly square to Pluto.
An elderly astrologer, a retired veteran of World War II, with a Moon in Libra, said that he agreed with him, because on December 7, 1941, when Pearl Harbor was attacked, the Sibly secondary progressed Mars was conjunct the USA MC within 29 minutes of arc, and the progressed Sibly Ascendant was conjunct the USA Jupiter within 18 minutes of arc.
Meanwhile, the seventh astrologer, who was a Pisces with Mercury in Aquarius trine to her Neptune, said that intuitively she felt they were all wrong, but declined to recommend which chart she felt was accurate for the country.
At 2:35 AM, a police cruiser stopped at the bus stop, as a neighbor had complained about the loud and relentless voice of the astrologer with Mercury opposite Pluto, and asked the group if they realized that the last bus had gone by while they were all arguing some three hours ago.
Sheepishly, they all said no, and a cab was called by the cop, and they all got home safely that night.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #6 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Sandee McMullan
 
ATTENTION: Oh my, you missed the Scorpio rising Chart July 4, 1776, 2:21 pm, Philadelphia....  
http://www.homestead.com/politicalastrology/scorpio.html
I found this while reading articles at www.stariq.com
Also a historical chronology of world events and such things as challenger explosion are at www.infoplease.com
Regards Sandee
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #7 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Rose A. Jenkins
 
Dear Lois, While all of these charts have significant features, I've found that the US Chart: 7/4/1776, 2:17 am, Philadelphia, PA is the one that consistently shows US events of major importance.  
This is the Uranus rising at 8º Gemini chart (53 min. earlier than the time shown in the 2nd chart above). I use it because it accurately reflected the Civil War, World War II and other events. Our major conflicts seem to be tied to the Uranian transits, particularly associated with the Gem/Sag axis and by its progressed angles. While I haven't investigated all of the historical info above, I feel that 8 Uranus/Gemini *IS* the chart of the US.
Therefore I submit this chart for serious consideration. For other corroborating factors, I recommend that those interested consult Nicholas Campion's Book of World Horoscopes, particularly p. 408 ('98 ed.) It may be vexing to consider the possibility of using a "rectified chart" for the US, but, afterall, the exact moment of the birth of a nation depends upon many things, not the least of which may be the "hand of the Divine" working with the active human agents. So, I challenge astrologers to try this chart and compare it with the events listed above.
Thank you for an opportunity to put this chart forward for consideration.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #8 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Natori Moore
 
Good luck on creating U.S. chart consensus. I've not seen any issue over which astrologers argue more vociferously. For my money, Solte's Articles of Confederation Chart works extremely well. (Though as posted here on astrodatabank, it is incorrect. It should have Aquarius rising and Scorpio Sun in the Ninth House.) See Mountain Astrologer Feb/Mar 1992 issue for complete historical justification of this chart, as well as my article on the events at Pearl Harbor 1941 (www.soulfoodastrology.com/articles/articles.html) using this chart as support for my assertions.  
Natori Moore, C.A. NCGR
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #9 - on: 22.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User dave ryan
 
 The traditional time of 2.17 local mean time on July 4 1776 has two very powerful pointers to this being correct.
Uranus ruling science, the enlightenment to come and humanitarian values in the age of the new man is right on the Ascendant coloring the whole chart.
While with the benificent combination of Venus Jupiter and the Sun all in the second house of money, the future wealth of the country is writ large for all to see.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #10 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User
 
DOES ANYONE HAVE THE SCORPIO RISING CHART? CONCIDERING THE PSYCHIC EXPERTISE OF THE FOUNDING FATHERS, THEY MUST HAVE CHOSEN THE EAGLE AS A SYMBOL FOR A REASON.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #11 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Janet Benedict
 
I too am a fan of the astrologer Evangeline Adams Gemini Rising chart for the US. The data: 7/4/1776--Philadelphia, PA--2:13:32am, despite the lack of evidence supporting an early morning signing of the Declaration of Independence The 7 degrees of Gemini Rising grants the US an amazing ability for education and communication. The conjunction of Uranus the Ascendant at 8 degrees of Gemini to gives the US some element of instability, nonetheless it signals an inherent need for freedom and independence which will not be denied. The planet Mars also in Gemini in the 1st House at 20 degrees, also serves to emphasize a willingness to fight for this independance. The Sun in Cancer, in the 2nd House, shows us as a place interested in acquiring wealth, safe and secure homes and stresses the importance of family values. The Sun's conjunction to Jupiter also located in the 2nd underscores the notion that we take care of our own as well as the world. The Moon's location in 18 degrees Aquarius, in the 10th House clearly shows that we are not afraid to display our humanitarianism to the world
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #12 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Caroline Keenan
 
For as long as I've been an Astrologer (many moons) the debate has raged on. But I had always accepted the old Dane Rudyar chart as approximately correct mainly because I believed that it best described the cowboy temprament of the American Persona. With this recent attack on New York and Washington I assumed that the question would finally be settled with Pluto being the significator. It is after all the big money interests that were chiefly attacked and effected. Pluto being the chief indicator of the second house money interests: banking and oil in particular. That was the point of the attack was it not?
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #13 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Bill Lindsay
 
I think some inductive reasoning is in store and it is time we started looking at history a little more realistically. The fact is that the American Revolution was no 'common man's' war, but a business decision. 'We' were fighting an 'oppressor' 3000 miles away, who could really only oppress us (at the time) through economics and business. The reality was that it was the local powers (people who owned businesses and land, and thus had influence in the legislature) who felt oppressed and had to convince the local farmers that they too were suffering under the rule of this 'wretched king'. There were many here at home who did not feel anything either way about England. But the (business) leaders of this land had to find some way of enlisting their help in order to force England to give up its share in their take. This country was not founded so much on 'ideas of freedom', as it was founded on 'freedom of trade and resources'. Let's get real. The men who have the most gold aren't concerned about freedom for the masses(many of them at that time even employed involuntary servitude). They can do basically what they want, even influence the law. That is exactly what happened. They had to rationalize forcing England out of the game. It was an act of collusion among businessmen to persuade the innocent citizenry that they were being unjustly ruled and to seek their support in a war against England. We had England beat on many fronts....we had lots and lots of familiar territory, we had plenty of resources (don't tell me we didn't have money...how were we able to buy off so many enemy soldiers), and 3000 miles of distance. We just did not have enough people and real support on our side. Ideas don't start wars. Real needs---resources, money, land---do. Our leaders did not like the fact that they were legally bound to the crown, and wanted nothing less than home rule for themselves. They wanted to do the taxing. We must face the truth. We are a very highly economically competitive nation. If someone's got something, we want it here. Our agility in building technology is rivalled only perhaps by the ancient Egyptians. We will use cutthroat tactics to gain economic advantage, even if it means overtaxing our people, underpaying foreign innocents, starting wars, or at the very least lying to ourselves to rationalize a move. That is a challenge to our national character that we struggle with. I think the chart that best reflects this struggle is the initial one, the mid-Sagittarius rising one. The concern over home-rule, economics, hidden motives and agendas are seen in the big-time powerful 8th House of this chart. We can also see the fact that we are actually very poorly organized and not necessarily 'just' is seen in the heavy challenges to Saturn in Libra. A Saturn that is sufficiently supported shows one who is sure of his beliefs and standards. As a nation, I don't think we are. Yet we are high on education and put a heavy premium on communications, reflected in the powerful Jupiter and Mercury. The Sun is good, too, though challenged, at least we can practice any kind of art here (so long as no one is offended, remember we struggle with expression versus fairness and respect). Moon near Pisces shows how we need to know the truth and the realities, which is what Pisces is all about. I can also see Mars square Neptune, and if this were a single person I was interpreting then I would say that there is a rescuer mentality, especially with Sagittarius rising. This person is eager to 'save' others (not without preaching his own philosophy, or possibly imposing it), but reluctant to deal with the inside. We need to deal with the confusion inside before we can be truly strong, otherwise we continue to feed off of others. Thanks Smiley
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #14 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Sandee McMullan
 
SCORPIO RISING CHART!!! I have found this article "Why Scorpio Rising" (political astrology - Michael O'Reilly). There is data for events that give evidence to 8*Scorpio rising ... including the explanation regarding the choosen symbol of the bald eagle as it appears on the United States national seal. The comments added for the comparison to the Gemini rising chart states further that there is no evidence for this sign rising. It proves interesting reading!  
 http://www.homestead.com/politicalastrology/Main.html
Regards Sandee
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #15 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User alice moore
 
I agree with ladyaquarius. Gemini Rising for the national chart seems the most accurate for the following reasons. 1. Uranus rising in Gemini in the 1st trine Saturn in Libra. This country will not be told what to do!!! However, the ideals, though new, were acceptable to the middle class. 2. Sun, Jupiter, and Venus in Cancer in the 2nd house make this country business oriented. Women have more opportunities than in other countries. 3. Politicians that have Gemini, Cancer, and Aquarius strong in their charts have had the most success(FDR, Ronald Reagan, Calvin Coolidge, JFK, Abraham Lincoln). 4. Politicians that have had a strong Libra component in their charts have had rockier or controversial tenures (Jimmy Carter and Bill Clinton). This I think is due to Saturn in Libra in the 4th house.[nb: George W. has BOTH components strong in his chart]. 5. With a Stellium of planets in the 2nd House economic success is so important to this nation, a politician can be excused of felonious conduct as long as the populace percieves itself to be "well off".
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #16 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Dave C.
 
Dear Astro Databank,
I'm writing in to express my reasoning behind my support of the Sibly chart with the 12 degree Saggitarius ascendant, cast for July 4 1776, at 5:10 PM EST. I'd like to bring up a few key points here.
To start with, I believe that a Saggitarian ascendant (in the Aries decan) is most reflective of the United States for a few reasons. The American spirit has certainly been, throughout America's history, an optimistic attitude with much hope and faith in the future. In addition to this, however, there also seems to be within the collective psyche of the nation, the assumption that this is the "best" nation, insinuating the characteristics of overconfidence and competitiveness, perhaps typical of a Saggitarius ascendant in the Aries decan. Also characteristic of the Saggitarian ascendant is the tendency of the United States to assume that it always is in command of the moral highground, perhaps due to its deep religious leanings.
Having made mention of the religious stature of the United states, let's take that a little bit farther. The Saggitarius ascendant is disposited into the seventh house placement of Jupiter in Cancer, taking the personality of the U.S. to the proverbial "other guy". Jupiter in Cancer brings us a wonderful picture of the charitable efforts that the United States prides itself upon, but to look a bit deeper we're going to find that most of our international charitable organisations and efforts have a Christian religious bent to them. America seems to have the monopoly on the archetype of the missionary. We may bring food, medicine, education, and some other resources, but in addition to this we give out a healthy dose of dogma. Smiley
This is echoed somewhat by the ruler of the 9th in the 7th, conjunct Jupiter, ruling the ascendant.
Using the placidus house system, which is my preferred house system, Neptune is in the ninth house and widely conjunct the midheaven. At the same time that this can be indicative of our strong sense of idealism and indeed the "American Dream", it also can be an indicator of what is now commonly termed "the fleecing of America". With Pisces intercepted in the third house in this chart, it may be difficult to communicate our ideals or the need for them, though the advertising of them is certainly apparent with this Neptune placement. Neptune conjunct the midheaven indicates a nation that is very sensetive to the needs and opinions of other nations, and indeed scrutinising of them as indicated by the Virgo placement, and yet at the same indicates the vulnerability of the United States as a nation. Of a necessity, the biggest targets are the easiest to spot.
Speaking of spotting targets, it is interesting to note that the recent attack on the World Trade Center towers coincided with the crossing of Pluto across 12 degrees of Saggitarius, which is the ascendant in consideration. Pluto is the ruler of the 12th house cusp in the Sibly chart, the 12th house classically being called the "house of secret enemies". It is now firmly believed and substantiated to a degree that the attackers had inside help, perhaps from US citizens. Perhaps Pluto's transit of the U.S. first house will unmask secret enemies of the U.S. - that is, unless their identities continue to remain as well hidden as they are now. All things considered, we have had a number of diagnosed cases of anthrax, and even a small number of deaths, but no idea of the perpetrator, only speculations of who it might be or could possibly be.
The Moon's placement in Aquarius in the third house could serve as an indication of America's need to communicate it's independance. America was birthed out of a desire for freedom of choice and of expression in the area of religion, and fought to become independant of England out of it's desire to separate from the doctrines of the Church of England and the Catholic Church. The root word of "protestantism" is "protest", a typically Aquarian ideal. This is not surprising about the United States in lieu of this chart, due to the fact that the Moon becomes the dispositor of Jupiter in Cancer. In addition, this third house Aquarian placement could be indicative of our will to communicate our humanitarian drives. The Aquarian Moon is disposited into the sixth house where Uranus is placed, indicating a need on the part of the nation to provide a humanitarian service to the world.
Additionally and finally, Saturn in Libra in the tenth house should be considered. Saturn is associated with discipline and responsibility, and Libra is associated with justice and fairness. Saturn in this chart is in the sign of its exaltation and the house of its accidental rulership.
[continued in next posting]
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #17 - on: 23.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
[continued from posting above:] by Dave C.
The concept of holding people accountable for their actions, treating people fairly, and bringing them to justice is certainly one of the most advertised of American concepts. However, let us consider the square of the Cancerian Sun to Saturn in Libra in the tenth house. Oftentimes, and dare I say usually, the sense of mechanical coldness and personal detachment necessary to execute unbiased justice in the legislative and judicial branches of the U.S. government is impinged upon and tainted by any intrustion upon the ego (Sun) of the nation, which is inherently affiliated with the emotional attachments of its Cancer placement.
I do hope this post wasn't too long, but I wanted to give a lot to consider here. This chart is abundant with American character.
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #18 - on: 24.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User kerrie
 
Dear Astrodatabank,
Wow - there's a preponderance of information to sort through with this one. I admit at first I cheated (mercury in aries) and looked for when Alaska and Hawaii were inducted into the union. Though 7 months apart, I got a jupiter at 23 scorp each time. I looked for it transiting the 4th house, trining the IC or harmoniously aspecting the ruler of the fourth. I got two charts - the sag rising and the 22 gemini rising for July 4, 1776.
But I tried to stay unbiased and at first compared all 7 charts to the events of Pearl Harbor. Again, I came back to the same two charts. After the 5th historical incident comparison, I'm prone to lean more towards the gemini rising 22 degrees chart, but still think it may work in either case. Here goes.
Pearl Harbor: Saturn just entered the 12th house in the gemini chart. It's also conjunct transiting Uranus at 27 degrees taurus. It was hard to get to our enemy even though we knew that Japan was our enemy (unlike Al Qaida). But I looked first for 12th house stuff and saturn in this chart rules the 8th of politics and death (we sanctioned Japan first before they attacked with our oil embargoes). Mars is in the tenth in this chart at 15 degrees aries (WWI had this 15 degrees aries aspect - a war thing with the US) opposing natal saturn in the 4th - war. Transiting Neptune was in the fourth conjunct the Solar eclipse making it hard for us to see at home that we'd be attacked. It's also in a far degree square to the Asc. Jupiter, the planet of good fortune typically, is in the 12th being also hard to grasp for energy. When it eventually moved into the 1st house in May of 1942 is when we counterattacked and made success of our missions in the Pacific. Uranus is also squaring the MC in this chart coming from the 12th - suprise, covert attack that wounded us very openly and deeply. That's it for this event. I'm trying to stick with only three to four aspects to back it up and there's no way I was going to go for the progressed charts as well. That would take forever, but that's probably where the solution lies between these two charts.
Entered WWI: Different type of war.Mars is squaring the ruler of the 7th - war with open enemies. Saturn was conjunct mercury on the cusp of the 2nd while opposing pluto from the 8th and also in a conjuction with the lunar eclipse. Mercury rules the chart and 4th house. That was a very depressing war and financially draining at the time - especially since it was the first world war ever. Transiting Pluto is conjunct venus in the first lending support that this war was the war the States ground its teeth on. Mars transiting is in the 10th and so there's really no question about the choice to go into this war. It was our duty and it was publically known we'd fight the good fight. Once again, mars is opposing natal saturn in the fourth while the sun was also in the tenth house at 15 degrees Aries. I actually liked the sag chart more for this one to tell the truth.
Stock Market Crash: Now with this one, I definitely leaned towards the gemini rising chart. With the gemini chart, we've got an 18 degree aquarius moon. The solar eclipse was at 18 degrees taurus (finances) coming from the 12th house (guess they didn't really see the crash coming) squaring the moon, which is the ruler of the second house of finances. Then we've got Pluto at 19 degrees cancer (ruled by the moon) inconjunct the aquarius moon, which is the ruler of the 2nd again. Pluto in this chart rules the sixth house of jobs and lots of people lost theirs and had to adjust. Transiting saturn is just inside the 7th (hard on relationships of all kinds and in general hardship and growing up) inconjunct mercury which rules the 1st and 4th - hard on us all as a nation and inside almost all homes. Pluto is also coming very close to moving into the 2nd house and what followed was the Great Depression. I didn't like the sag chart for this one as mars was trining the second house cusp and a few other things that didn't totally make sense to me.
Alan Shepard, the first American in Space: This one was fun and interesting to analyze. The solar eclipse that year was at 15 degrees Aquarius and a far conjunction for transits to the 18 degree Aquarius moon. In the gemini rising chart, aquarius rules the 9th house of distant travel. In the sag chart, it rules the 3rd house of short trips that aren't so distant. This was the one that made me think the gemini chart was a bit better.
[continued in next posting]
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re: Nation: USA No.1
« Reply #19 - on: 24.10.2001 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
[continued from posting above:] by kerrie
Venus was at 24degrees aries in the 11th house (space age/aquarian house) ruling the twelveth (real spacey) and 5th (adventure and theatrical) trining the moon in sag in the 7th house (moon ruling the 2nd house natally and the space program was something Americans really valued deeply at the time and were determined to follow through with) - sag being a distant traveler again. Then finally forming a grand trine to uranus on the third house cusp at 21 leo- Uranus again ruling the 9th house of distant travel. With the sag chart, the grand trine falls in life houses with uranus in the 9th, which also makes sense. But I liked the grand trine better in the air houses as space travel is definitely an offshoot of our flight exploration and seems ruled by the intellectual air signs. With all the signs in fire signs, there's definitely adventure too. This was a nice chart to look at.
The End of Segregation: Venus is at 22 gemini and right on the Asc - just passed over mars in the 12th. With it being retrograde, we can see that the effects of ending segregation are not as they seemed..."miles to go before I sleep." The solar eclipse is also at 19 degrees gemini right on the mars/Asc/venus conjunction really stirring up some interesting energy that year. The lunar eclipse that year was at 3 degrees Capricorn and opposing natal venus also lending more evidence to the fact the civil rights war was not over just because segregation ended. The eclipse was in the 7th of open enemies and it did seem that many of the racist people back then were pretty open with their hostilities. Jupiter was in the 11th of organizations and groups (the whole movement finally came to fruition) and jupiter rules the 7th house of open enemies, so they couldn't stop the group from having the light shine on them. I also think that the solar eclipse conjuction to mars in the 12th brought a lot of light on subconscious anger, yet the venus and jupter aspects overcame it. The other thing I looked for in this chart was what Chiron was doing. I thought it seemed more appropriate in the 10th versus the 4th transiting. In the tenth it is a public healing, though not at all at the roots of what the problems were. When I analyze Chiron in the 10th, I also look to the Saturn return of the event to see if the true power has been finally recognized. In the early 90's we see the emergence of hip-hop and other very cultural African American movements that lend credence to perhaps being much closer to true integration than we ever were in the 60's.
While I agree that it doesn't at all make sense for the Declaration of Independence to be signed at 3 in the morning, I can only think maybe that's when it was finally written with all revisions for the last time after two days of talking by the candle light. I know John Adams said it would be impossible, yet his grand-daughter, Evangeline Adams stuck with the gemini rising chart and was one of the best astrologers ever. I also read somewhere that all of the signers were Masons, and so have all our Presidents been, save one - JFK. The Masons did/do know a lot about astrology, so it's not totally unreasonable in that light. Perhaps their secret society just doesn't want anyone to know?hmm. Don't know, just know that I liked the gemini rising chart the best with analyzing it all.
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30-Aug-2014, 06:12 UT/GMT
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