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Astro-Databank: Carl Sagan (Read 451 times)
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Astro-Databank: Carl Sagan
« on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
Discussion about
Carl Sagan, born 9 November 1934 at 5:05 PM in New York NY
 
This discussion is imported from the  comment board on the  previous astrodatabank.com website.

We thought it would be interesting to study Carl Sagan's chart this week. Sagan was a brilliant scientist, an astrophysicist who achieved rock-star status with his "Cosmos" and "Contact." While we astrologers share his awe of the natural world and thrill at his work, we despair that Sagan was dismissive of astrology as "pseudoscientific twaddle." Let's study his chart for clues to his life and his approach to the cosmos:
  • Carl Sagan received numerous awards including the Public Welfare Medal, for "distinguished contributions in the application of science to the public welfare." The award recognizes his ability "to communicate the wonder and importance of science," "to capture the imagination of millions" and "to explain difficult concepts in understandable terms." What are the astrological factors that describe his three-fold ability to captivate his audience in such a way?
  • Sagan was not complimentary toward astrology. What in his chart suggests that he would be so dismissive of what we might consider to be astronomy's conjoined twin?
  • How would you interpret the Scorpio stellium in his 6th house and the Mars-Neptune conjunction? What do these placements lend to his personality, the events of his life and his career?
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #1 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User geoffrey hillend
 
2. Sagan lacks air in his chart; his only air sign planet is Saturn in Aquarius. Saturn in Aquarius can only has a scientific view of the world which is limited to cause and effect reality, the physical world, classical physics, general relativity etc. and not quantum physics. One must learn to use the Uranian intuition which can be repressed by the fear of Saturn. It is interesting to note that in his later years his viewpoint became more accepting to UFO phenomenon and he had a more universal viewpoint which is necessary for the fullfilment of north node in Aquarius. His words "extra ordinary claims require "extra ordinary evidence" is true but it takes the intuition to understand the extra-ordinary evidence. One must view the occult and astrology with a whole conscious judgement involving all for functions in Jungian typology: Thinking, Feeling, Sensation and intuition. A scientist who thinks that science is limited to thinking and sensation does not know that it takes a flash of insight to come up with a new idea and theory
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #2 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User paulo
 
Saturn in MC. says all. Like in Gauguelien research Saturn is strong in scientists
paulo
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #3 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User paulo
 
i dont agree with the other fellow,. i got saturn in aquarius 10 degrees from the MC and for a long time believed in astrology. Now im researching,after reading www.astrology-and-science.com
paulo
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #4 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
Sidereal Zodiac Chart Ascendant is 3°Libra56' Tropical Zodiac Chart Ascendant is 27°Libra46'
Better Find out Where the Error is ... At Least Before to Many People Place Foot in Mouth because they Failed to Catch that Detail. I would check that chart with a few programs!
Peace Everyone
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #5 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
Opps ... My Mistake ... I put 5:05 AM ... Sorry Everyone!
Peace
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #6 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User  
 
so i gues that means that you just put your foot in your mouth?
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #7 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User
 
Another research indication might be the stellium in Scorpio in the 6th house - detailed, curious, likes to expose the truth.
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #8 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
He Would Have Been the Classical Forensic Scientist Working with Investigating the Homocides, as I see the Quincy Jones type of Character Here ... A Slight Difference though in Approach and P.R. but I think everyone may get the Idea.
That Saturn(Sxt)Moon with 10th House Indicates a Mortician Type of Occupation that Would Come Natural with Inner Gifts.
Peace
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #9 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User
 
Not, I suspect, a mortician...
Ar=Su/Ze: Men active out in the public world - Creative persons - Creative leadership out in the public world Ar=Kr/Po: spiritually lofty - prudent - wise - knowledgeable - insightful - understanding - cultivated - has unique ideas - intelligent with abstractions - ingenious -Important knowledge out in the world - Extraordinary discoveries - Intellectual or spiritual authority - Public intellectual or ideological leadership - Mental giants
Ar-Me/Ad: mentally profound - thinks analytically -  
Ar=Ar/Ve: even-tempered - attractive - congenial - sentimental - harmonious - peaceful - friendly - charming - aesthetically-conscious - appreciates art - Harmony out in the public world - Widespread enjoyment - To experience sympathy - Affection - Love - Attractiveness - Art or aesthetics out in the public world -  
Ar=Su/Kr: self-reliant - independent - self-confident - authoritative - has outstanding skills or talents - commanding - above average - seeks to excel - seeks to lead - claims authority - Official leader - Outstanding public personalities - To belong to the elite - To hold a special public post - To be privileged - To be respected - Important  
Ar=Ze/Po: intellectually agile - convincing - persuasive - resourceful - intuitively guided - acts insightfully - disseminates confidence - Intellectual or spiritual work - To make lucid decisions - To advocate truth or facts - Intellectual debates  
Ar=Mo/Sa: Separation/s of/from the wife - To leave things behind - Problems related to women - Solitary women - Estrangement -
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #10 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User M
 
Poor Carl Sagan...Caput Algol rising...Venus, the ruler of the ascendant...debilitated in the 6th house of illness...combust the sun and with the southern scales of sorrow...that he lived to be as old as he did is astonishing..of course a sorrowful demise is shown...
Saturn in the 10th house..shows a fall from grace, but in its own house and in its own domcile gives renown and a steady rise...Aquarius is the scientific...though born jewish, it would show him to be an apostate and advocate of science and science fiction...
The north node with the midheaven..a fortunate career, public success..public favor...in Aquarius..public good, science..welfare..organizations...
Pluto in Cancer..is the apex of a Yod and the apex of a wide out of sign t-square..making it important...in the third house of writing is where he achieved his fame, recognition and purpose..Pluto in Cancer..is oddness and extremes in the home..in the third house...certaily Cosmos and Contact focus on looking for ones home in outer realms...
Saturn in the 10th house in Aquarius is sole in air..giving him the scientific appeal and science fiction edge...The Mercury/Neptune conjunction has to do with science fiction/fantasy..in an earth and practical sign like Virgo shows why his aliens are more human like and Contact spends more time discussing the human element and interaction than the alien and bizareness of Rodenberry and Asimov..gives talent in writing...
The stellium in Scorpio gives sensuality and a great interest in sexuality..he was clearly a fan of sex...in the 6th house probably means he used it as a form of excercise or in his regular day life to help him write or break through "writer's block"  
 Despite the Scorpio stellium, Moon is in Sagittarius, Venus in Scorpio shows a need for sex but a conflict of sex and love, fidelity and experience, i doubt he was a faithful fellow to all his wives...
Moon in Sagittarius, Saturn in Aquarius is too much a science fan and not enough of mysticism, ud think with so much Scorpio, but not the case, far too fixed and stubborn..Aquarius is not Uranus..a strong Uranus makes an astrology fan, a strong Aquarius doesnt necessarily do the same...Saturn is too practical for astrology...Neptune is weak in Virgo, no Pisces...
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #11 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
The Yod with Pluto-Saturn-Moon is very important with career and health since the Moon is so close to the 8th cusp, and furthermore ... it would seem to me that the Sidereal Moon is Scorpio which is often difficult on the Emotions ... it may be a key point to the health of the bones and this is a cold placement with career work ... Carl's Body must have been very cold often.
Peace
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #12 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
Here we go with something of importance to those interested in another part of his life, the Mars-Uranus by Declination is definitely indicating that he is an accident looking for a place to happen. What a risky and dangerous plug-in there, and I would say that electrical, high-powered, scientific machinary was around him most of his life.
Peace
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #13 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User
 
Carl's heavy scorpio, effective host of the mysterious, that compelling voice, like Rod Stearling and Rober Stack, hypnotized audiences, with mars& neptune conj. in the 4th trine sun conj venus he drought mystery into our livingrooms. Last hs. uranus helps Carl's 7th hs. moon in sag. pulled by saturn to accomplish, regardless of the soft retireing, 4th& 6 houses and scorpio by nature wanting to hide. I suspect carl is, (was) very different on & off camera.  
The last hs.uranus, 3rd hs.pluto square gives his voice the edge, he makes, (made) his fortune by the way he spoke. Intense presence...00-03mercury genius, retrograde thinker BUT a sag moon wants field work, the sixth house does provide the physical good looks in keeping with taurus asc. BUT 9th house NN conj. MC, channels a lot of energy up ward.  
One wishes for a long life but this was a life cut short by illness, the body betrays, as saturn sun squares, especially with the last saturn return signaling...times up...you've over stepped yourself, been too charming for your own good....recall for defect removal.
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #14 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User lucia
 
the anon was me lucia
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #15 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Stands Pat with Full House
 
This was surely a rewarding life with soaring achievements. His book and the television series were masterpieces, and I loved them.
Though he died prematurely of an ugly disease, he was happy and merry through much of his life as shown by the Scorpio stellium which describes the intelligence. Mercury/Jupiter conjunctions are so common in scholars and professors. I think he was happier than most of us. The T-square Mercury/MC/Uranus is suggestive of physics or electronics, and in fact, this is a fine chart for a promising astrologer. The brilliant combination is common in astrologers, but I know it also favors math and physics, especially electronics and astronomy.
Though curious and sophisticated, he was very conservative. He probably played it far too safe much of the time (Saturn/Node/MC-square-Sun/Venus/Jupiter). A Scorpio stellium with a Taurus ascendant is also a sign of considerable conservative tendencies.
Science is found in the angular Saturn and the T-square. Professorship or scholarship are found in the Mercury/Jupiter conjunction and the Saj Moon.
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #16 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Mariposa
 
I've read / watched much of Sagan's work, but I was not aware that he was dismissive of astrology - and I'm surprised; it goes against the tenet "absence of evidence is not evidence of absence".  
1. North Node in 9th, conjunct the MC seems the obvious answer. The less obvious answer would be the Mercury Rx-Jupiter conjunction as part of that 6th house stellium. His work would be marked by an ability to explain concepts and ideas. Everyone gets all bent about retrograde planets, but I believe they lend a different (not necessarily hindered or delayed) effect to that planet's influence. Constance Stellas gives the example of Mercury Rx that sometimes you have to communicate with the native in negative/backwards terms (i.e., to a Mercury direct native one would say "do you want to do X" to solicit a "yes" answer while Mercury Rx would respond more favorably to a "don't you want to do X"). My example language is slightly convoluted but you get the idea (I hope).
And on another subtler point: the lack of air! He had to compensate for that somehow, not having been born with a flowing communication style, he had to cultivate one. I'd say he did an OK job. Remember also that Saturn ruled Aquarius before Uranus was discovered. This is an excellent placement.  
2. Pluto in 3rd squaring Uranus in 12th (not to mention Pluto as both the focal point of that Yod and T-square - yikes!) - no doubt he was a critical person and it shows through his writing, but I see Uranus in 12th as blurring his focus a bit - he wanted what he could definitively measure in one compartment (astronomy) and what he believed he could measure (the idea of extraterrestrial life) in another. Or perhaps it also has to do with the fact that astrology is not well received in scientific circles on the whole. His ideas were groundbreaking and his vision excellent, but all that Fixed isn't about to break the status quo without a boatload of proof. Heck - certain of my friends (mostly science folks) criticize me for studying astrology... my first house Pluto opposed the midpoint of my 3 degree Aries Sun/Moon conj in 8th make sure that never lasts very long. Wink
3. The 6th house stellium definitely does not bode well for a healthy, illness-free life. I am sure he was a workaholic type Scorpio and a sensualist, though I don't consider him classically handsome. As for the Mars-Neptune conjunction - it's in 4th, squaring Uranus in 12th - I bet there are some serious family secrets, at which he was the center... maybe adultery, maybe drugs less innocuous than pot... who knows. I can also see this combination as being possibly indicative of a very nasty temper.
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #17 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Robert Augustus Marriott II
 
Stands Pat with Full House ... I agree mostly with that, except for the Astrology Part ... and the mathematical side of Astronomy at best. I have noticed that specific periods of time during certain transits would have marked the most beneficial and gifted times which would have been coming from others who met with him. Notice the Mars-Neptune and the Venus-Sun and the Opposing Mid-Point would have indicated Key Event Times in his life, where strangers, acquaintances, and friends would have been there to help him in some special kind of way. It would've been a mysterious type of event, where you kind of scratch your head and wonder how you managed to have an important key contact pass by your way on the right day!
Peace
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #18 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Stands Pat with Full House
 
Mariposa, I agree so much about retrograde planets. I liked your interpretation, but Mars/Neptune is not square Uranus. It is almost unaspected, but I agree it has much to do with his tragic health problems. I am still pondering that odd conjunction and how it eludes connection.
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re: Carl Sagan
« Reply #19 - on: 01.06.2006 at 13:30 [UT+1] »
 
reply by Astrodatabank Web User Edwin Stuart
 
My article about Carl Sagan, "The Dragons of Sagan", appeared in an issue of the late Planet Earth magazine, I'm not sure which one. Mostly the article was a critique of his philosophy-- and he does have a definite philosophy that is probably most evident in "The Dragons of Eden"--and I just backed that up with a quick, superficial look at his horoscope. To quote from that article: "Not only does Sagan idealize the cerebral cortex as a logical, computer-like operation, but he seems to have an aversion toward the primitive depths of the mind. Who knows what beasts may lurk there? A glance at his horoscope appears to confirm this suspicion. It seems to me that there is a certain theme in Sagan's chart which also shows up in his writings. He has Saturn near the top of his chart, very fitting for such a high profile public figure with such an impressive list of credits, credentials, awards, and achievements. But since his Sun and three other planets are in Scorpio, this Saturn in Aquarius-- a highly ordered, mathematical sort of influence-- would appear to be the tip of an iceberg into which he has channeled all his Scorpio passion. This tendency is further reflected through the square of Pluto, ruler of his Scorpio planets, to Uranus. Again, we can see here a potential tug of war between the unconscious/ obsessive and the rational/ scientific. His Moon in restless, expansive Sagittarius, a placement which puts him in the same company as T.E. Lawrence (Arabian desserts), Herman Melville (the South Pacific), and Neil Armstrong (outer space), has no doubt contributed to Sagan's fascination with traveling to distant worlds and his quest of rationally understanding the entire universe, for which-- because of its connotations of order, harmony, and that which is accessible to reason-- he prefers the Greek term "Cosmos". His impressive book by that name can almost be regarded as an elaborate proposal to increase the budget for space exploration, a point he hammers home on the next to last page..."
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